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house

Room for Improvement ?

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Yo.

Do you guys think TS still have room for improvement in skills? 

Also, I know xwis was slower and gameplay was "different", but do you think the old elite players would be able to adapt and dominate TS again? 

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Posted (edited)

This was talked about in like 3 topics prior. This is an almost completely different game than what was played on wol/xwis. The absolute best players from xwis (mega, kapa, schaf, dlte, gster, diego, etc) would need time to adapt to the lack of delay in unit response time, but yes- if given 2-3 months time of constant playing, the absolute top players would be better than 99%, very possibly even all of us that play now, speaking as someone that played with all of the strong players from 2005 until now.

As far as raising the skill ceiling on TS, the top level players can only really improve their micro/macro, whether its upgrading equipment so they can see more of the map, or getting used to using more hotkeys. There are only so many actions one can do, and the tactics/strategies are all figured out. However...... the level of the average player can grow drastically if everyone actually focused on improving and unlearning bad habits, but there's no motivation to anymore. There arent clans or incentivized tournaments that give people the drive to do it.

Edited by c0rpsmakr

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Why don't you start a tournament? And some of the Ra2/yr people are working on clans support.

The Zero Hour ppl regularly (like twice a month or so) have tournaments with small cash pool of 50-150$. They also have a yearly world series to determine who is the best player.

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Posted (edited)

I was talkin to Sol a few weeks ago about it.. i watch games from 4~5 years ago from the top players playing and I dont see games right now being more skilled than those games.  Actually its the opposite.. 

Edited by house

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Posted (edited)

It was always my dream to

1. Get rich.

2. Sponsor big TS tournaments

3. ???

4. PROFIT (watch amazing games.)

 

I've been stuck at step 1 now for a long time and do not have any money, so I cant fund tournaments, otherwise I would. :)

 

As for the question of Improvement, YES I think there is tons of room for improvement, some of it is a lot of work, but some of it would also be incredibly easy. I barely ever see people adapt to their 2v2 partner. Having a coherent strategy goes a long way.

Edited by Sol
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15 hours ago, house said:

Yo.

Do you guys think TS still have room for improvement in skills? 

Also, I know xwis was slower and gameplay was "different", but do you think the old elite players would be able to adapt and dominate TS again? 

Is this a joke or a question? Play 10 giants games, then you know how endlessly big that room of improvement is ;P.  Haha :D .

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A lot of old players, some of the very best, have came back (some namehiding) and from what I have seen, about 4/5 of them are able to adapt to the faster gamespeed and within a couple weeks or months are able to hang with the very best current players or even outmatch them.  When Mola first came back it took him a few months to adapt to the higher FPS, and as a nod player that says a lot.  When Cambria first came back after years and years of not playing, it only took him about two weeks to be on top.  Some players have come back and even after months just were not able to adapt, firefox, insect, few others.  I think it depends on how long ago they played, and how much time they can afford / are willing to dedicate into re-learning things they have forgotten or adapting to the faster speeds.

Looking back, 52 FPS being max speed, and average game speed being closer to 48, is just really slow, but at 60 FPS, no matter how good the player, it is simply impossible to micro as many things at once and utilize things like firestorm generator as accurately.  Good nod players are forced to use high micro with positioning while defending, and it can be hard to utilize sub attacks at the same time, which is why Mola for example focuses on one or the other instead of trying to do both on a lot of occasions.

Players like mega would just have to be willing to stick it out for a week or two and would adjust like Cam did when he first came back.

Activity will never be as high as it was during 2000-2004 and without it the higher level players will become stagnant and not be forced to adapt/improve/innovate.  Inf rushes are way more common now days than they used to be and the majority of above-average players simply monkey-see / monkey-do, where-as the majority of above-average players back in the day were better at thinking on-the-fly and coming up with things on their own.  I believe this is the main reason why this game has basically become inf/titan wars and although there are a variety of attacks that work well, like defending inf rushes with multiple apc instead of using harvs or countering with inf, or sneaking a carry/eng or carry/gs attack while multi-task-defending are not as common as they used to be.

I personally think the average player is better now days than the average player from back in the day, but I also think that the majority of top players now are a bit stagnant for many reasons and would be forced to improve if some of the old elites came back.

If we had a clan system maybe 4-5 years ago I think it would have done a lot to save the game, but even if one came out in the next year or so it would surely help, at least a little, but I still think the only thing that would drastically increase activity is if EA does a proper remaster and the player base increases the way td/ra have.


Just my opinion though.

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Posted (edited)

Yea... the q point of the topic i wanted to point is: do you think the best players atm can get better ? Game has been released in 99, is there any skill that can be reached by the best players ? I think i agree with u, Humble.. its not possible without changes like clanners / more elite players active...

I see games that got "professional" like cs:go and pro players have stablished their function in every game, every map... its 5x5 matches and everyone has their role... 

Imagine a 4v4 where nobody can start the map without knowing their role in the game.. (im not talking about FF tm tl bridge ... im talking about deeper strategies

Edited by house

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Posted (edited)

As far as the 9/10 skill level players go there is only room for improvement In the area of unit control. The strategic meta of the game is at its peak and there is nowhere else for it to go. 

As for the lower skilled players. I see a lot of people that still don’t understand situation awareness and what to do when. For example, your next actions are different if you use 2 disrupters successfully vs unsuccessfully, but many people continue to react the same way regardless. They also have poor pathing for their expansion building placement and for expansion timing in general. Some of that comes down to experience but I’d say 90% of it is simply a knowledge base on that when your main patch is maximum 75-80% dry you need to stop what your doing and get to your next expand.

And then there are many players who have been coached and trained into oblivion, have 20 years of experience, have been told what to do on countless occasions, have speced  hundreds of games. And are simply incapable of executing what they know. Some people will never be able to perform under pressure. You see it in all activities.. In boxing you will see people who have all the skill and talent in the world when they’re inside the gym but when they are in a match it all goes out the window and they lose the fight to someone way worse than them.

The biggest advice I can give to new/struggling players is to practice and develops muscle memory for good habits so that when you are under pressure your panic reaction is to do the correct things. Just practice building out to the expansion patches on maps over and over in the most efficient and effective way possible. So that even when you are being rushed you just automatically put ur buildings down quickly in the correct places. Get a friend and practice disrupted/mk attack/defense. Practice building and engaging infantry rushes. Practice paying attention to the map and only looking at your base when you need to place a building down. Make practice games that are put in reps for all these things and then start playing 1v1s. But in your 1v1s don’t use shitter tactics like fast apc or 1 refing. Do things that are relevant for 2v2+ games like 4-5 ref with big infantry. And get in as many games as you can vs people at or slightly above your skill level. Don’t waste time playing against people significantly above or below you. The bad players will die easy and you won’t learn anything and the good players are going to troll/meme you and you won’t learn anything. And remember, even if you are losing don’t regress into doing last resort tactics like turtling and going all bombers. Treat it as a practice game where you continue to try and survive, expand, and retake control. 

Train unit control as often as you can with practice games. Even if your building and long game is horrible, somebody with high level disrupter/Titan/Mk/infantry control is going to get very far and be very dangerous. 

Finally. Remember to take your game play seriously. I’m not saying put it above other aspects of your life. But if you are going to spend time playing then put in effort. Especially if you are in a multi-player game with allies who are counting on your performance. Not caring about the game more than other games, friends, family, etc. isn’t an excuse to slack off and play half assed. Always do your best and go for the win.

Edited by Avesta
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Posted (edited)

@Avesta

And remember: Never let MikePence be left with one Hand of Nod! He can still be annoying as shit ;) 

Edited by Hungry Mike

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1 hour ago, Hungry Mike said:

@Avesta

And remember: Never let MikePence be left with one Hand of Nod! He can still be annoying as shit ;) 

Does this forum have an ignore function?

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12 hours ago, Avesta said:

Does this forum have an ignore function?

Upload that game please :D 

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Well guys, Id say, I come back for 5 Weeks, just dominate everyone of you.

Just to show...

Greetings. 

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6 hours ago, Sexbomb said:

Well guys, Id say, I come back for 5 Weeks, just dominate everyone of you.

Just to show...

Greetings.

Its good to dream big bro, keep it up :)

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Posted (edited)
18 hours ago, Sexbomb said:

Well guys, Id say, I come back for 5 Weeks, just dominate everyone of you.

Just to show...

Greetings. 

If there were more people available that could provide a competitive challenge nothing would make us happier. As it stands there are less than 10 active players capable of participating in a high level 2v2 game. 4 of whom are too ignorant and embarrassing to be seen in the same channel as.

But id wager half my net worth that you won’t even be able to cover an infantry rush in a 2v2. All old schoolers are the same, especially the ones with a history of using cheats (90+%).. (I have no idea who you are so I’m not accusing you)

Edited by Avesta
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On 6/15/2020 at 12:52 AM, Sexbomb said:

Well guys, Id say, I come back for 5 Weeks, just dominate everyone of you.

Just to show...

Greetings. 

6 ref into death will work even less on cncnet unfortunately

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Posted (edited)
On 6/15/2020 at 9:52 AM, Sexbomb said:

Well guys, Id say, I come back for 5 Weeks, just dominate everyone of you.

Just to show...

Greetings. 

My Arnolds great you back :). They can need a good bite of new inf; they need beef! But please dont run, if you see them...

Edited by Hungry Mike

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7 hours ago, Avesta said:

If there were more people available that could provide a competitive challenge nothing would make us happier. As it stands there are less than 10 active players capable of participating in a high level 2v2 game. 4 of whom are too ignorant and embarrassing to be seen in the same channel as.

But id wager half my net worth that you won’t even be able to cover an infantry rush in a 2v2. All old schoolers are the same, especially the ones with a history of using cheats (90+%).. (I have no idea who you are so I’m not accusing you)

Well, I don't know who you are.

But I guess, everyone who was beating you were mapping ?  :D I got accused a lot for that.

1 Time I bugged TL with my barracks,  ( 1on1 vs stefor ), he left the game with "omg" without sending one inf out to scout.

The only one cheating as shit was mola -_- :D

 

"Cover" an Inf rush in a 2v2.

I bet I wouldn't even need anything less to kill you, with alting grenadeaeeers and inf to.

But I guess in 1999 or 2000 you didn't even know what computers were -_-

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4 hours ago, Sexbomb said:

Well, I don't know who you are.

But I guess, everyone who was beating you were mapping ?  :D I got accused a lot for that.

1 Time I bugged TL with my barracks,  ( 1on1 vs stefor ), he left the game with "omg" without sending one inf out to scout.

The only one cheating as shit was mola -_- :D

 

"Cover" an Inf rush in a 2v2.

I bet I wouldn't even need anything less to kill you, with alting grenadeaeeers and inf to.

But I guess in 1999 or 2000 you didn't even know what computers were -_-

Well we will never know since only one of us has the balls to get online.

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Is Mike Pence an average to low player in Tiberium Sun like he is in Tiberium Dawn or is he higher up than that?

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19 minutes ago, Tiber Shark said:

Is Mike Pence an average to low player in Tiberium Sun like he is in Tiberium Dawn or is he higher up than that?

Top 5 EZ

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35 minutes ago, Tiber Shark said:

Is Mike Pence an average to low player in Tiberium Sun like he is in Tiberium Dawn or is he higher up than that?

Hahaha, dodger. I am elite in TD. And you can laugh at me in TS, if you want: The laughing stops, when my hungry Arnolds and CCs march to your base :).

So come play me in TD, but it wont take longer than 5 mins.

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, Sexbomb said:

Well, I don't know who you are.

But I guess, everyone who was beating you were mapping ?  :D I got accused a lot for that.

1 Time I bugged TL with my barracks,  ( 1on1 vs stefor ), he left the game with "omg" without sending one inf out to scout.

The only one cheating as shit was mola -_- :D

 

"Cover" an Inf rush in a 2v2.

I bet I wouldn't even need anything less to kill you, with alting grenadeaeeers and inf to.

But I guess in 1999 or 2000 you didn't even know what computers were -_-

Some newb mentioned my name and cheating, lmao.

Which was your main log anyway, i dont recall sexbomb 😕

 

Anyway come online and lets see how well you do :)

Edited by Weaponx

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Posted (edited)

Weapon X = mola?

If ur seriously stefor, I played with Alex0019 nick in the game I mentioned.

"Hater win, TS Loses" I tried to find the screenshot of that. But otherwise, you should know who I am.

Im Nod1lol, S3xXxbomb :D

U cheating fuck :D:D:D 

 

Well seriously, someone called NME (Didn't remember his mainlog) told me he's stefor :D

Who is he?

And for the moment, I was online yesterday, but didn't have the time to figure out, how to play Tiberian sun on Parallels or 27" iMac Pro.

Blackscreen if I allow tibsun to :D

 

Edited by Sexbomb

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