TS Viewpoint Conflict

[Avesta]

3 hours ago, c0rpsmakr said:

YES, it does force people to play the game the way they want it for anybody who wants to play the ladder, every single map is a vet map, every single one. I've even asked for half vet/half regular maps to be brought to the table but that idea was rejected. So, again, and for the final time, YES IT DOES.

Whether you like it or not, competition needs to be fair and balanced.

Whether you accept it or not, vanilla TS and the stock maps are not fair and are not balanced.

Modification  to make it fair and balanced need to be forced into it. Otherwise we are holding PvP competition that is unfair and unbalanced.

Why is this so hard for you? Do you not understand the concept of fairness? If you prefer being at a disadvantage that’s fine and you can put yourself in them all you want in FFGs But don’t FORCE everyone else to deal with them by advocating for massively unsymmetrical maps and incomplete units in competition.

Edited May 4, 2020 by Avesta

[Avesta]

5 hours ago, amokk said:

could it be implemented with a tick box in the settings the host can check apply the vet patch ??   like firestorm or not?

i suspect you are nowhere near to a final set of changes though.........and editing maps would let each play as they like, until

Hear Hear!  the thousandth time i have said this>>> both ways more ways, not one way Play anyway you like.

  >>  I am as glad that you can play your way as that I can play my way!  <<  feel free have fun with it. 

 

PS> and not just what you like or think or want on the ladder,   the thousandth time this has had to be discussed. The map selection should be a representative selection of what the whole community plays ! ! !   Not the subset of them you altered to suit your tastes.

If you cant hang on the maps the community has been playing for the last 20 years,  > you suck >  .

spread out your tanks so one bomber doesn't kill them all, dummies..

m8, nobody is trying to edit your giants of war map.

Edited May 4, 2020 by Avesta

[Weaponx]

Anyone who watched the videos of 5-7 ticks getting rekt by 1 bomber even in deployed mode, and think it’s fair, are just idiotic.   
 

That was not the attention of Westwood/ EA and they would have fixed it, luckily CNCNET and a team of players have fixed the issue with a vet patch. Deal with it, it is that simple. End of topic.

 

[amokk]

7 hours ago, Avesta said:

m8, nobody is trying to edit your giants of war map.

I do not understand your comment..

how are you offended by this?

build a way to easily implement what you like into the client..

play what you like?

and suggesting the maps you play be included in the tourney as well??

 

??????

 

 

Edited May 5, 2020 by amokk

[Weaponx]

You’ll also be crying when people eng rush you or send you harv bombs on giants or other shit, because your so called “rules” aren’t followed, and they wouldn’t be in ladder, why would they? 

Edited May 5, 2020 by Weaponx

[olliegator]

C0rp's has nothing credible to say against Vet just getting angry at players for calling him out, maybe you did teach me back in the day when I was a young teenager first coming online. But guess what, now i'm one of the best and understand this game better than you. So don't pipe up to me i'll smoke you 20x in front of 6 specs repeatedly. Hurry up and go back to Xwis then. Sick of seeing you on Cncnet if you're going to bitch about it, go on then use the other server.

[Ender_TS]

Corps and amokk have made thier point of view very clear and I agree with both.   There is nothing wrong with Vet its basically like visc maps or bbg or giants or what ever other fix or mod made over the years.   Ok we get it,  you made a fun mod  for the 15 to 20 pleople who play only terraces for years and years.  Im sure they are grateful for the efforts made.  But in the end it is a mod like every other on TS.

I see about 100 players who play Giants of War or other mod maps every day.  Over the years the mod players have always been criticized from the one map pro players,  things like mod maps are for noobs or low skill and many other insults we dont need to note here.  Its the same thing,  they are playing a mirror map with mods to make the game balanced and easier for new players to join and have fun.  Its the same thing you are tryin to do,  but do you hear them saying we should change all maps and game play to giants mechanics?  Maybe we should put this to a vote for every player online who plays TS . You would have more poeple voting for giants mechanics since there are more giants players LOL.  Would you like to have giants mechanics forced in your terraces games  or other westwood style maps?  I think not.   So just call it what it is, a mod and let people play what they like. Dont force anyone to play it on ladder or on server level. 

You also have to remember that many of us have been here for like 20 years and this game is a classic.  The version made by westwood and release to us over 20 years ago is the standard version and the soul of this game.  Its the reason we are all here in the first place.  Just show your appreciation and let the classic game live on and play your mod with your frieds as you like.

I see some of these post talk about vet beeing made by the community but in reality this was not made by community, but by a small group of players.  Who have opinions like if you dont like vet and dont want to play with us you are a bad person and a noob, but if you like vet you are a good guy and part of the pros LOL.  Thats how you build a community for sure. 

 

 

Edited May 5, 2020 by Microsoft

[Weaponx]

Your post make no sense at all.

Vet is not "mod" it is MINOR fixes to balance the game, which Westwood would have done if they did not die and left the game filled with bugs.

If we follow your logic cncnet should leave all bugs and not fix a thing ? That is just silly leaving stuff like ALT with planes, build everywhere bug, planes getting bugged, etc.

It is pretty simple cncnet have the rights and can choose how they want to host the servers. They have implemented their own ladder system, which is different from westwood.

If you want to play game as it is, and cant live with "vet",  i suggest you jump to xwis, or even host your own server? No one is stopping you.

 

[Ender_TS]

14 minutes ago, Weaponx said:

Your post make no sense at all.

Vet is not "mod" it is MINOR fixes to balance the game, which Westwood would have done if they did not die and left the game filled with bugs.

If we follow your logic cncnet should leave all bugs and not fix a thing ? That is just silly leaving stuff like ALT with planes, build everywhere bug, planes getting bugged, etc.

It is pretty simple cncnet have the rights and can choose how they want to host the servers. They have implemented their own ladder system, which is different from westwood.

If you want to play game as it is, and cant live with "vet",  i suggest you jump to xwis, or even host your own server? No one is stopping you.

 

Thanks you made my point. Great followup post.

[Weaponx]

Well you want some bugs fixed, and others not fixed? It does not make sense.

 

 

[Ender_TS]

1 hour ago, Weaponx said:

Well you want some bugs fixed, and others not fixed? It does not make sense.

 

 

The only thing there is to understand is that the Vet mod is cool, have fun playing it. 

Some pople dont want to play Vet maps and thats also cool. They should continue to play their own favorite mod maps or standard maps if thats their choice.

We all played the game when ALT scout was possible and we still played great games.  If anyone ALT scout we just kik or ban.  Simple solution to simple problem.  I played vet map recently and I see that planes still get stuck out of screen and what did I do?  the same as always dont let the pads be full when plane is ready.  So vet is not fixing this problem and we still work around it vet or no vet. 

I will make this comment about the ladder since you mentioned it in your early reply. The ladder is cool but it fails the community since only the players who like vet are accounted for and cosidered in the map selection, so only the 20 guys who play vet should participate and enjoy like you are already are doing.   The rest will simply ignore the ladder since its not ment for all members of the community in any case.   P.S  the original ladder was much better since we could select the map and also create random map with a click,  you could easily create a map that was one of a kind and test your skills vs others with out the benefit of knowing very detail of the map....

Long story short just let people enjoy the game and stop trying to force your favorite mod on everyone. 

[Weaponx]

Alt  =  kick or ban?

Well first you cant do that in ladder games if ALT was not fixed, you are forced to play or surrender.

2nd some people see this as unfair i never did, you still spend cash on a plane and let it fly into enemy base, but that's besides the point. You cant have "alt fixed" and then not other issues fixes, stop cherry picking. 

Banshee fix on vet works, the maps it does not work in, you tell and it will be fixed. It is separate issue for each map, which needs a short fix.

The ladder never existed like this on old ww, this is the cncnet ladder, and its much more active then it was to start off ever since vet was fixed into it.

No one is forcing anything onto anyone, you can play any map you like if you host.

If you want to play cncnet ladder, then you have to live with the facts, that  the server decided it should be vet. It is pretty simple.

[Ender_TS]

18 minutes ago, Weaponx said:

Alt  =  kick or ban?

Well first you cant do that in ladder games if ALT was not fixed, you are forced to play or surrender.

2nd some people see this as unfair i never did, you still spend cash on a plane and let it fly into enemy base, but that's besides the point. You cant have "alt fixed" and then not other issues fixes, stop cherry picking. 

Banshee fix on vet works, the maps it does not work in, you tell and it will be fixed. It is separate issue for each map, which needs a short fix.

The ladder never existed like this on old ww, this is the cncnet ladder, and its much more active then it was to start off ever since vet was fixed into it.

No one is forcing anything onto anyone, you can play any map you like if you host.

If you want to play cncnet ladder, then you have to live with the facts, that  the server decided it should be vet. It is pretty simple.

Hi Weapon its clearly not possible to clarify a point of view since your english comprehension is very limited.  I said that Alt did not need to be fixed...  so your point about cherry picking is just your lack of understanding when reading.

On the old ladder you had a choice of who you play so you can ban or kik before game even started.   And yes we did have  a one click map generator it was really great.

 

 

Once again your point about the ladder is your lack of understanding when reading since I clearly said that it was only for the vet players and all others just ignore and dont play,  so yes you basically made my point again.  

[amokk]

4 hours ago, Microsoft said:

 The rest will simply ignore the ladder since its not ment for all members of the community in any case

it is meant for everyone.

 

Edited May 5, 2020 by amokk

[Weaponx]

I do understand fine, you perhaps do not want to understand.

 

Yes you said, alt do not need to be fixed, but haven’t complained about it has been fixed, you have accepted it, as a fix without issues. And your logic for letting it be fails hard, I mean “kick players or ban” who uses alt? If it is not fixed, it just means it is allowed, just like using S with subs. Now it’s fixed because it’s seen upon as unfair/ poor sportsmanship. 
 

alt is just one example of one bug fixed, there are plenty more which you haven’t noticed but take for given..

so yeah it is cherry picking, when you don’t mind some bugs have been fixed, and haven’t said a word probably because you haven’t noticed. If we follow your logic all bugs should be undone, to be true to original ts, now how idiotic would that be.

like I said this is not Westwood or EA, it’s cncnet. They fixed some bugs, unbalanced units and put a ladder system which is different from the old one and better. 

is it your opinion ladder is only meant for vet players, ladder is for everyone who wants to play, but yes the ladder is balanced with vet maps and also balanced with matching games on random maps, with random players and fractions. Which is much more fair then the old one, and truly shows where your skill cap Is.

That’s the ladder cncnet has chosen. I’ve seen plenty of modders and new players jump on ladder and improved their gameplay, perhaps you should play it more? 

So if you can’t handle cncnet server, feel free to go xwis or any other server, or host your own? 
 

Edited May 5, 2020 by Weaponx

[Hungry Mike]

3 hours ago, Microsoft said:

If anyone ALT scout we just kik or ban

1) Ppl dont get banned or kicked or admit they lost, when they use bugs or break rules. I experienced it very well on GIants or Conflict, when Kossuth secretly picks his hungarian friends as allies by colour, fooling the others its random, and then bashing noob team after noob team; the same with the 10 % of time, i really am right about a bug (and not just crying like a baby ;D) - ppl refuse to correct it. So we need a bug fix, hence the Vet Bel Mod/Patch. Its a great thing! 

2) Dont compare the Vet Bel Mod to GIants lol. Its true, there are some skilled giants players like Firestar, Jaro or me (;P), but there is also a big fat noob farm, too. Giants is a completely different game, while the Vet Bal Patch just kills bugs and makes Arnolds a bit better.  So i Mola is right, you cant compare these two things, its laughable. Not that GIants is bad, its good and fun; but its a completely different topic and has nothing to do with the Vet Bal.

3) Which point made Amokk or Corps clear? Anyone is free to play, what they want. But in ladder games, you need to compare ppl. We cant put FS on or multi fac on, i am all for it; but i dont need it either. But noone cries about that. But when bugs and unfairness gets fixed a BIT, you complain. The ladder is an unimportant part of the game, and many of the guys who talk here dont even use(d) it/would use it. If they would allow Vanila games, you would just refuse to play Vet games, and try to force others to play what you want. Mola even plays Vanila games with guys like Tigerr, he tries to include them. Noone forces you, Microsoft, to play the Vat Bal game. Where do we force you to play it? Nowhere. And noone forces you to play Ladder. You can argue to change the ladder, but you can as well let it stay as it is with good reasons.

4) I hear ppl complain EVERY time my Arnolds eat someone up. They are op, lalala. I want to see them use Arnolds: if its so easy, it should be a piece of cake. And dont forget: I used Arnolds in vanila first, i didnt even know they changed it, but they are stronger now. WIthout me using them for fun, noone would even know by now that Arnolds can be good :P.

[Ender_TS]

1 hour ago, Weaponx said:

I do understand fine, you perhaps do not want to understand.

 

Yes you said, alt do not need to be fixed, but haven’t complained about it has been fixed, you have accepted it, as a fix without issues. And your logic for letting it be fails hard, I mean “kick players or ban” who uses alt? If it is not fixed, it just means it is allowed, just like using S with subs. Now it’s fixed because it’s seen upon as unfair/ poor sportsmanship. 
 

alt is just one example of one bug fixed, there are plenty more which you haven’t noticed but take for given..

so yeah it is cherry picking, when you don’t mind some bugs have been fixed, and haven’t said a word probably because you haven’t noticed. If we follow your logic all bugs should be undone, to be true to original ts, now how idiotic would that be.

like I said this is not Westwood or EA, it’s cncnet. They fixed some bugs, unbalanced units and put a ladder system which is different from the old one and better. 

is it your opinion ladder is only meant for vet players, ladder is for everyone who wants to play, but yes the ladder is balanced with vet maps and also balanced with matching games on random maps, with random players and fractions. Which is much more fair then the old one, and truly shows where your skill cap Is.

That’s the ladder cncnet has chosen. I’ve seen plenty of modders and new players jump on ladder and improved their gameplay, perhaps you should play it more? 

So if you can’t handle cncnet server, feel free to go xwis or any other server, or host your own? 
 

NICE LOL.   You dont seem to understand that we actually agree that vet is a nice mod.  Kik and Ban is a normal practice on TS, I mean you do it to many players every day...  You once again made my point by noting that some of you decided that the behaviour of S should be changed just because of your opinion or the opinion of a few players.  That is the point of the whole discussion, you cant change the game and call it standard TS and say that its the best hahaha....

And your attitude of play the game my way or just leave the game is also very limited like your comprehention abilities.  All we are saying is play the vet mod and enjoy.  Play the ladder with only vet maps and enjoy as well.  And let everyone else enjoy ther mod maps or standard maps as they like.  This is simple enough for you ?

[amokk]

24 minutes ago, Microsoft said:

like I said this is not Westwood or EA, it’s cncnet.

and it's not not yours to do with as you please.........

Edited May 5, 2020 by amokk

[Weaponx]

You are clearly retarded. I never said anything about the use of S, I gave it as an example, where some players see it just as much as a bug as alt, where I see them both fair. Which also is besides the point and S haven’t been changed so what are you on about ?

The point Is cncnet have chosen to see alt as an bug or as unfair sportsmanship, and decided it should be fixed, just as they fixed bug build, and many other things. They have improved ts in many areas such as FPS, bugs and game balance. If you dislike this and prefer  ts untouched filled with bugs, I suggest you find another server,  also I couldn’t care less what you do.  

Cncnet also  have contact with the original developers and programmers, and they have said the game was left unfinished, unbalanced  and filled with bugs.

 

let me clarify once again:

CNCNET runs the show, and they have put the work and time into fixes & bugs and a ladder system. If you don’t like their way, then your on the wrong server.   Is that clear enough for you?

 

 

48 minutes ago, amokk said:

an it's not not yours to do with as you please.........

No it’s cncnet  to do with as pleased, as the have they current rights to host the servers. So get educated?
 

But feel free to complain to Westwood studios/ EA, and see what  happens. Answer: nothing.
 

Edited May 5, 2020 by Weaponx

[amokk]

1 hour ago, Weaponx said:

No it’s cncnet  to do with as pleased,

and they made the client, server, and ladder for everyone.......

 

are you saying you speak for them?   >>>  or are you just running your mouth???

Edited May 5, 2020 by amokk

[Weaponx]

I don’t know if your slow or just born retarded. I’ve never said I speak for any one, have I? 

First off,  I just stated that I  agree with the changes they made and if you can’t handle that, isn’t my problem.

2nd I stated this ain’t Westwood or EA, it’s cncnet, and they run the things they way they want to. Like vet, fixes and game balance, ladder  and on, so if you do not like it, that’s to bad. 
 

It isn’t so hard to understand this ?

 

[amokk]

just running your mouth then..

 they made the client, server, and ladder for everyone.......

if you don't like it leave..

Edited May 5, 2020 by amokk

[Weaponx]

Retarded or something? It seems so.

Like I said the ladder is fine and I think it’s great work done by cncnet and the team.

Your the one crying and apparently don’t understand shit ?

 

Im done wasting time with idiots  like you.

 

[amokk]

47 minutes ago, Weaponx said:

Like I said the ladder is fine

I think it is not

it does not have a representative variety of maps

just the ones you like,

just the ones you feel are worthy,

just the ones you think should be on it.

that is not right.

there should be maps that the rest of the community plays.

 

Edited May 5, 2020 by amokk

[Avesta]

1 hour ago, amokk said:

I think it is not

it does not have a representative variety of maps

just the ones you like,

just the ones you feel are worthy,

just the ones you think should be on it.

that is not right.

there should be maps that the rest of the community plays.

 

Can you give some examples? Which maps aren't included that the rest of the community plays?

Edited May 5, 2020 by Avesta