Red Alert 2:YR AI improvement mod (Update!! 1.18.05.16) Compatible with CNC client now

[RaVaGe 596]

I'll try it out soon, you've got my curiosity.

[TK3600 18]

New Update:

1. Tank auto crush is even more aggressive. Instead of crushing when enemy is point blank, AI tanks will crush the moment infantry fire on them. (range=4)

2. Adjusted trigger priority to make AI select tank rush more frequently over infantry attacks.

3. Tesla trooper ranged buffed to regular infantry's range (4).

4. Nerfed ridiculous damage of garrisoned Yuri Initiates. This is the first and hopefully last nerf I will give. Yuri initiate's damage goes from 25 to 63 when garrisoned, more than doubled. In comparison both GI and conscript gain 5 more attack in buildings, like 25 to 30 and 20 to 25. It looks seriously buggy to have this much gain, enough to melt apocalypse tank before it can fire. I nerfed damage to 40 and 50 (elite) from 63 and 73. Still noticeably stronger than GI and conscripts.

5. Easy enemy can now build miners, yay! It is actually a serious buff for them. Before that medium enemy is waaaay stronger than easy.

6. New script for spy to attack refineries.

7. In general easy and medium enemy got buff with larger team size.

8. Easy Soviet AI actually garrison battle bunker now.

9. Separate task force for allied chronosphere attack. It uses more resilient tanks than regular tank rush to survive in middle of base longer.

10. Easy Soviet AI now build 1 apocalypse tank.

11. Increased chance of AI naval bombardment.

Edited January 3, 2018 by TK3600

[TK3600 18]

On 1/1/2018 at 11:55 AM, FReQuEnZy said:

I'll try it out soon, you've got my curiosity.

How did it go?

[vase070 4]

Wow this is super hard almost impossible thou, i could defend myself but when i ran out of money it was over theres even no point in getting oil drs they just destroy them instantly i even tried with bridges destroyed they just send a ton of air units and ships and the momment you run out of money its over 

Not gonna lie its really really hard but thats why i love it

For now all i can suggest is if you can make the gold digger thingy constantly make gold there was a mod i played that had this feature because the momnent you run out of money its over 

But that aside really well done on this mod i like it a lot i really hope that the cncnet team can find a way to get this mod to work online i would like that a lot i will post again once i played some more games 1v7 

This mod is exacly what the "Brutal AI" option in the cncnet client should do

[RaVaGe 596]

This mod changes game balance though, so it's not the same as vanilla YR.

[TK3600 18]

41 minutes ago, FReQuEnZy said:

This mod changes game balance though, so it's not the same as vanilla YR.

This mod started as my personal mod. You are somewhat right, perhaps I should not include the changes as a package when submit to CNC staff. But I think I was really careful, all I did was changing uselsss units into mediocre units. Meta strats like Rhino rush is still meta. Tesla troopers still sucks. OP vanilla units like Prism tanks is still OP. I avoided any controversial changes like nerfing Prism tanks. If anything some of my changes benefited players, like making apocalypse tank acquire target on the move. AI can already do it by cheating, and they fire on the move with prism tanks too.

I am open to criticisms though. If you think any change is unjustified, let me know.

[RaVaGe 596]

I don't think any of them are unjustified, just that by past discussions I've seen that the staff prefers their game balance vanilla.

Say we had a CompStomp game mode and when players come from the competitive scene (yeah some will) they expect to need to cntrl+shift (attack move) their apocs, however in your mode they can just move them like rhinos.

If you can make the ai "cheat" and make them work the same way then that would be preferred as it would leave the player side of the game intact.

[RaVaGe 596]

I tried to test your mod and the Ai was slightly better, using more teams to defend and building more factories, though the Ai is slow and open to rushes.
I'm not sure if that's what it's supposed to do, but I copied your files and ran the original YR executable as mods are normally used. 

So far it was only slightly more challenging.

[a1nthony 66]

Can you just make your edited “mods” affect the AI only? That would probably help. And while a general buff to brutal ai is good. Taking it to the next level by being map specific would definitely be the next step in improving the ai

[TK3600 18]

2 hours ago, a1nthony said:

Can you just make your edited “mods” affect the AI only? That would probably help. And while a general buff to brutal ai is good. Taking it to the next level by being map specific would definitely be the next step in improving the ai

Like I said, it started as my personal mod. I am willing to make a seperate AI only mod, but it takes time to edit out stuff one by one. What I will do is submit only AI related change to CNCnet staff. By the time it is added to client as an option you will have it.

[TK3600 18]

5 hours ago, FReQuEnZy said:

I tried to test your mod and the Ai was slightly better, using more teams to defend and building more factories, though the Ai is slow and open to rushes.
I'm not sure if that's what it's supposed to do, but I copied your files and ran the original YR executable as mods are normally used. 

So far it was only slightly more challenging.

What do you think my AI need more to deal with your strats?

Before I add more code, there are other things you can do. There was numerous updates in between. It will be slightly harder, especially easy and medium enemies. As for you rushing down AI before it builds anything, there is nothing I can do. AI is too easily baited, and cannot micro manage unlike humans. What you can do is fighting multiple AI or choose to have no starting units. I assure you having no starting units are way harder. I could kill 2 brutal AI by engineer rush and starting rhino rush too. With no starting tanks it is hard to pull off.

[TK3600 18]

15 hours ago, vase070 said:

Wow this is super hard almost impossible thou, i could defend myself but when i ran out of money it was over theres even no point in getting oil drs they just destroy them instantly i even tried with bridges destroyed they just send a ton of air units and ships and the momment you run out of money its over 

Not gonna lie its really really hard but thats why i love it

For now all i can suggest is if you can make the gold digger thingy constantly make gold there was a mod i played that had this feature because the momnent you run out of money its over 

But that aside really well done on this mod i like it a lot i really hope that the cncnet team can find a way to get this mod to work online i would like that a lot i will post again once i played some more games 1v7 

This mod is exacly what the "Brutal AI" option in the cncnet client should do

Thanks for the feedback! While I will not make the gold digger constant as it upsets meta, but I will make a seperate you a mod with it. I will PM you a link.

[RaVaGe 596]

1 hour ago, TK3600 said:

What do you think my AI need more to deal with your strats?

1

I noticed the Ai made two refineries at start this time which slows down the speed at which it makes a factory and thus units from it, speeding up how fast the Ai get's a factory will make a big difference. 

Other than that it's the unit composition you should work on. If the Ai makes kirovs and gets ready to attack with them, it should follow up with some terror drones aimed at anti-air units. 
Stuff like that which makes the Ai harder more annoying to deal with.

[TK3600 18]

34 minutes ago, FReQuEnZy said:

I noticed the Ai made two refineries at start this time which slows down the speed at which it makes a factory and thus units from it, speeding up how fast the Ai get's a factory will make a big difference. 

Other than that it's the unit composition you should work on. If the Ai makes kirovs and gets ready to attack with them, it should follow up with some terror drones aimed at anti-air units. 
Stuff like that which makes the Ai harder more annoying to deal with.

Great idea! I will put it in!

[vase070 4]

So i wanted to do some testing and loaded arctic circle and set up a 2v2 match ( me and a brutal ai vs 2 brutal ais 1 soviet 1 allied )

I destroyed the bridge on my side but left the one on my ally's side 

So here's what i noticed

1. The first major thing i noticed is the ai can train units out of all 3 war factories AT THE SAME TIME ! yup thats right i just saw 3 kirovs come out at the same time 1 from each WF (the same is with tanks) 

2. The ai sent a lot of tanks on the other side of the bridge i destroyed and they just sit there and do nothing the bridge near my ally is open so they can still come but i guess not they want my bridge lol (i did fix the bridge later and they indeed started to move the tanks) but thats just strange 

3. The ai's air defense is garbage looking at their air defense i can prob destroy their whole base with just 2-3 kirovs and some good micro, maybe make them build like 10 flak trucks or ifv's 

4.the ai dont guard Superweapons AT ALL! i mean these are pretty important buildings worth a lot of money and they just put a wall around them like always and thats it 

5.i know you said the ai is supposed to guard war F , refinerry a lot better but from what i saw the ai dont guard War F at all 

6. They dont bother getting all the oil dr from the map just the ones that are close by the rest they just destroy even if no one has them 

7.the ai dont use the water transport AT ALL! ( i noticed this while playing on an islands map where there was no bridges ) they do use ships thou and a lot but i think they should still use the water transport to attack with tanks or units or to even capture tech buildings 

8. Im sure you know this by now but the ai dont repair bridges .... I mean this whole mod is about making the ai smarter so i think they should be able to repair bridges 

9. They dont use siege chopers to attack with at all they just build them and afk in their base 

10. Same goes for battle fortress have not seen the ai use a BF to attack with or even to defend 

 

Wef that was a lot of writing and il do it again because i think this mod has great potential and i really want to make it better and to see it in the cncnet client 

[TK3600 18]

9 hours ago, vase070 said:

So i wanted to do some testing and loaded arctic circle and set up a 2v2 match ( me and a brutal ai vs 2 brutal ais 1 soviet 1 allied )

I destroyed the bridge on my side but left the one on my ally's side 

So here's what i noticed

1. The first major thing i noticed is the ai can train units out of all 3 war factories AT THE SAME TIME ! yup thats right i just saw 3 kirovs come out at the same time 1 from each WF (the same is with tanks) 

2. The ai sent a lot of tanks on the other side of the bridge i destroyed and they just sit there and do nothing the bridge near my ally is open so they can still come but i guess not they want my bridge lol (i did fix the bridge later and they indeed started to move the tanks) but thats just strange 

3. The ai's air defense is garbage looking at their air defense i can prob destroy their whole base with just 2-3 kirovs and some good micro, maybe make them build like 10 flak trucks or ifv's 

4.the ai dont guard Superweapons AT ALL! i mean these are pretty important buildings worth a lot of money and they just put a wall around them like always and thats it 

5.i know you said the ai is supposed to guard war F , refinerry a lot better but from what i saw the ai dont guard War F at all 

6. They dont bother getting all the oil dr from the map just the ones that are close by the rest they just destroy even if no one has them 

7.the ai dont use the water transport AT ALL! ( i noticed this while playing on an islands map where there was no bridges ) they do use ships thou and a lot but i think they should still use the water transport to attack with tanks or units or to even capture tech buildings 

8. Im sure you know this by now but the ai dont repair bridges .... I mean this whole mod is about making the ai smarter so i think they should be able to repair bridges 

9. They dont use siege chopers to attack with at all they just build them and afk in their base 

10. Same goes for battle fortress have not seen the ai use a BF to attack with or even to defend 

 

Wef that was a lot of writing and il do it again because i think this mod has great potential and i really want to make it better and to see it in the cncnet client 

Thank you for your detailed feedback, I really appreciate it!

 

1. That is an unavoidable headache. AI simply refuse to build a 2nd factory despite there is a setting for it. I think ARES fixed it, but I do not know how to make use of ARES. What I did is duplicate war factory so AI will make a clone of it. Those are not yet coded into AI's patrol pattern. Because of this I tend to make soviet AI make units in multiples of 3 so there is no left over.

2. The solution is to make way points, and that I think is map specific changes. The way it works is AI choose an enemy to focus down to not make AI go back and forth between bases. That unfortunately means they will keep going after you and not change mind for your allies. So be nice and avoid AI exploits if you want a challenge.

3. Boy, if you think that is garbage Vanilla AI sucks more. In fact, they don't even build the 5 AA tanks I scripted, they rely purely on AA defense structure, which becomes useless the moment power go down, and is not helpful because by the time kirov is in range it is too late. I did try larger task forces, but it tend to clot the base and make tanks stuck. I will see if I can enlarge it a bit more, and try make base more spacious.

4. I blame this on me. Like I said, this started as my personal mod, and I always play with super off. All my AI tests are without super either. I will fix it ASAP.

5. Like I said, the extra factory are duplicated and I forgot to include them in the script. Yes, their building number is different and require extra codes.

6. I am aware of this. I already set capture oil to the highest priority. I also set oil as a priority air strike target. Sometimes it means blowing up neutral one too. It is not perfect, but I think it is alright. What ever is far away is hard to guard, and AI is rarely low on money (hacks), may as well blow them up to frustrate the cash hungry players. Also it blows up unreachable dericks on island so players cant have it.

7. Yes, it is on my big priority list. I think I figured out how to do it, should be in the upcoming update. Though AI is limit to 1 transport, so dont expect land sized invasion. It will be a harassment at most. I will however compensate by modify naval strike code to make island maps more interesting.

8. This seems to be map specific changes. There are tutorials about it. Maybe, just maybe I can figure something out as a general change. No promise.

9. They are bugged for some reason. I want them to deploy as base guard, they just wont. They for now serves as a frustration for attacks without AA.

10. That is not true, AI always have BF for defense. I cannot make it attack because it will only attack alone. To pair up with other tanks infantry fail to go in.

 

The CNC client version is under work. What I will do is submit a basic version first, if it works I will use the full version. It is because there are 100+ changes and I do want to commit unless I know I can make it work. I am pretty new to modding actually, so I have no idea how to submit context specific changes.

Edited January 4, 2018 by TK3600

[vase070 4]

12 hours ago, TK3600 said:

The CNC client version is under work. What I will do is submit a basic version first, if it works I will use the full version. It is because there are 100+ changes and I do want to commit unless I know I can make it work. I am pretty new to modding actually, so I have no idea how to submit context specific changes.

AWESOME i cant wait btw does this forum not have a modding section ? I think it does you can maybe ask for help there if you dont know anything or how to, still waiting on the new version so i can do some more testing 

[RaVaGe 596]

On 1/4/2018 at 12:24 AM, TK3600 said:

Like I said, it started as my personal mod. I am willing to make a seperate AI only mod, but it takes time to edit out stuff one by one. What I will do is submit only AI related change to CNCnet staff. By the time it is added to client as an option you will have it.

 

11 hours ago, vase070 said:

AWESOME i cant wait btw does this forum not have a modding section ? I think it does you can maybe ask for help there if you dont know anything or how to, still waiting on the new version so i can do some more testing 

You can keep the threat level changes as well, the Brutal Ai option when hosting a game is actually controlled by a ini file in the game directory, so you can edit that.
Though keep in mind that it only accepts rulesmd.ini edits as far as I know and you can't play other hosts who have brutal AI turned on, as your file will differ from theirs.

Just include the threat level edits and others of the like.

[TK3600 18]

1 hour ago, FReQuEnZy said:

 

You can keep the threat level changes as well, the Brutal Ai option when hosting a game is actually controlled by a ini file in the game directory, so you can edit that.
Though keep in mind that it only accepts rulesmd.ini edits as far as I know and you can't play other hosts who have brutal AI turned on, as your file will differ from theirs.

Just include the threat level edits and others of the like.

Unless your buddy also change brutal AI file. Just show them this thread.

[TK3600 18]

New major update:

1. AI is more cautious, taking distance more seriously when choosing target.

2. Fixed a mistake which mind control units are not as high threat due to special threat rating being override by conventional one. They should be focused down now.

3. Kirov should have terror drone support now. They are made subsequently instead of grouped together, because it would prevent Kirov from going across water. Idea from FReQuEnZy 

4. Black Eagle now has a script to strike on construction yard. All 8 of them are able to destroy it in one run. Can be very dangerous!

5. Increase harrier strike frequency.

6. AI respond to base threats faster.

7. Fixed large units stuck at regroup command.

8. Fixed air strike on neutral oil derick.

9. Made Dreadnaught and carrier defend itself. Please test if it is buggy. I want to finalize RulesMD.ini changes so I can start export it to CNCnet client.

10. Allied AI build extra grizzly early on, and defends 2nd factory. This is to make AI harder to rush early on, as reported by FreQuEnZy that AI build up are too slow early on.

11. Adjusted AI Trigger success delta to account for 2 track record.

12. Added an experimental script to make AI repair nearest bridge.

13. Added an experimental script for Allied AI transport 4 prism tank across the water. Please report if it is functional.

14. Added a permanent factory guard for Allied factory, instead of patrol.

 

On 1/5/2018 at 2:19 AM, vase070 said:

AWESOME i cant wait btw does this forum not have a modding section ? I think it does you can maybe ask for help there if you dont know anything or how to, still waiting on the new version so i can do some more testing 

Indeed. When I run into problem I can ask CNCZ and ProjectPerfect mod.

[vase070 4]

15 hours ago, TK3600 said:

New major update:

1. AI is more cautious, taking distance more seriously when choosing target.

2. Fixed a mistake which mind control units are not as high threat due to special threat rating being override by conventional one. They should be focused down now.

3. Kirov should have terror drone support now. They are made subsequently instead of grouped together, because it would prevent Kirov from going across water. Idea from FReQuEnZy 

4. Black Eagle now has a script to strike on construction yard. All 8 of them are able to destroy it in one run. Can be very dangerous!

5. Increase harrier strike frequency.

6. AI respond to base threats faster.

7. Fixed large units stuck at regroup command.

8. Fixed air strike on neutral oil derick.

9. Made Dreadnaught and carrier defend itself. Please test if it is buggy. I want to finalize RulesMD.ini changes so I can start export it to CNCnet client.

10. Allied AI build extra grizzly early on, and defends 2nd factory. This is to make AI harder to rush early on, as reported by FreQuEnZy that AI build up are too slow early on.

11. Adjusted AI Trigger success delta to account for 2 track record.

12. Added an experimental script to make AI repair nearest bridge.

13. Added an experimental script for Allied AI transport 4 prism tank across the water. Please report if it is functional.

14. Added a permanent factory guard for Allied factory, instead of patrol.

tried to test this but game crashes 2-5 secs after loading into the map i also tried run as administrator its the same thing so i deleted the mod and the game worked fine i don't know what the prob is but you might 

[TK3600 18]

3 hours ago, vase070 said:

tried to test this but game crashes 2-5 secs after loading into the map i also tried run as administrator its the same thing so i deleted the mod and the game worked fine i don't know what the prob is but you might 

Crap, I will hotfix it.

[TK3600 18]

4 hours ago, vase070 said:

tried to test this but game crashes 2-5 secs after loading into the map i also tried run as administrator its the same thing so i deleted the mod and the game worked fine i don't know what the prob is but you might 

Can you download it again? Seems fine on my end.

[vase070 4]

1 hour ago, TK3600 said:

Can you download it again? Seems fine on my end.

now it does not crash 2-5 secs after map load, but after 5-7 mins of gameplay it crashes, tried 3 times same thing happened ofc i tried removing the mod and game worked fine no crashes

EDIT: i just tried on 4 diff maps it still crashes after 4-7 mins of gameplay 

Edited January 7, 2018 by vase070

[TK3600 18]

1 hour ago, vase070 said:

now it does not crash 2-5 secs after map load, but after 5-7 mins of gameplay it crashes, tried 3 times same thing happened ofc i tried removing the mod and game worked fine no crashes

EDIT: i just tried on 4 diff maps it still crashes after 4-7 mins of gameplay 

Try Russian Roullete. I tested on this map and it seemed fine. Does the map you used have water?