WIP-Tiberian Dawn for Pros (replacing original campaigns) testing/ideas

[MattAttack]

I'll just edit this old ass post since no one ever really read it anyways....

 

fancy logo, eh?

 

So here we are almost 4 years later and I now know waaay more about making missions and have been making much more serious progress on this ancient project..... Here I will dump the mission files for testing purposes.

 

Also, I am soliciting any mission ideas, half-finished maps etc. for this project.  Post your input, people!

 

**EDIT:9.18.15**  GDI/Nod 1-4 with alternates (13 missions) complete.  Download from here: http://cnc-comm.com/community/index.php?topic=4480.0

For now I've taken down all of the test missions.  Thanks to everyone who tested and actually gave me feedback, your help was tremendous. 

 

SCG01EA:Replaced the old "Blood Beach" with this easier mission.  Return Nikoomba to his village. (where in canon he then gets killed by Nod.)

 

SCG02EA:After the public outcry of the difficulty of the old version of mission 2, I made this much easier map.  Still a lot of fun and I learned a lot about patrols.

 

SCG03EA:One of my personal favorites.  It's my homage to GDI 3 (the SAM/Grenadier one.) Much like the original, just on super steroids!  You don't have to destroy the SAMs to get an airstrike, but it helps your a-10s to do so. And as Chimas pointed out, it's also my inadvertent homage to 'Twist of Fate' since you gotta guide your MCV to an appropriate area!

 

SCG4EA:Another one that I'm really proud of.  First, outrun the commandos chasing you, keep Nod from destroying too much of the village and then build up and smash your enemy!

 

That's all the screens I feel like adding now, more to come!

 

 

 

[Nyerguds]

Hmm, a campaign, WITH alternates?

 

(If you don't have alternates, you can put campaigns in the New Missions menu in C&C95 v1.06c, you know )

[Kilkakon]

I had a play with this map set this morning. It's pretty insanely hard... the GDI one has so many minigunners everywhere that I probably need at least 200 to get through the Nod defences. I've managed to beat Nod Mission 1 though, although I literally had to put each commando on a different ctrl+number to keep the micromanagement fast enough to kill all the enemies. Lost all of the commandos in the end, but managed to finsh it. So they are possible, but pretty darn hard.

 

At first, after playing the rather bland looking GDI Mission 1 thought that they would be plain maps, but all the others are pretty nice.

 

Personal gripe: Commandos on guard don't do anything.

[Chimas]

Haven't play it yet.

If you group commandos, they will reload instantly.

In practice, when 1 is reloading all the others are ready.

[Kilkakon]

Nice fancy new icons

[RC1985]

Here's my playthrough of missions 1-4, http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL-Ecy11VjzuzKn4dNpIywScVMz302gBZS . They're very tough indeed, though of course I enjoy challenges. Will try completing the rest after I get back from my hiatus

[MattAttack]

Well, I started some work on the beginning Nod missions.

 

I think most of the TD people have seen these, but after having read this article and this article, I was inspired to follow a more puzzle based approach to some of the missions.  So [glow=red,2,300]here[/glow] is my Nod mission 1.

 

Let me just say "allow win" is one of the most dysfunctional triggers in the game.  I even looked at the original/covert ops missions and found it didn't even work right in those!  In "the tiberian strain," there is an "allow win" trigger for killing all the gdi units.  I tested it and it doesn't even work!  In the actual WW missions!  sheesh.  BUT, I figured out a workaround* so you are able to win by killing all neutral and gdi units.  If anybody cares, lol!

 

*it involves reinforcing a money c-17 to the special house for "all units destroyed" when all GDI units destroyed, and another for when all neutral units destroyed.  The actual "win" trigger is achieved when the special house reaches a certain amount of credits..... (and special is allied with ALL houses involved, so there's no c-17s trying to "bomb" anything)

[Chimas]

Whenever I find time to test the "Allow win" trigger, I'll let you know. Not working is weird ...

[MattAttack]

I think "allow win" only seems to work with the "built it" trigger (a la Nod 5) and "player enters" (Nod 6)  I know for sure the "Built it" works, but I'd have to test the "player enters." Again, to cite my experience making maps for Kilk, where there's like 6 houses involved, it was impossible to make it winnable destroying all of the houses using an "allow win" trigger.

 

**EDIT: I tested "player enters" and it works.  Even in conjunction with "all destroyed!"  WhoO!

[Nyerguds]

If I remember correctly, the C17 bombing stuff was easy to avoid by using a different command, or something...

[MattAttack]

If I remember correctly, the C17 bombing stuff was easy to avoid by using a different command, or something...

come to think of it, I believe "unload" stops them from bombing...

yep just tested it.... no need to ally

[X3M]

This actually sounds like an awesome idea.

But, why didn't you just add? Why is it replace? Simply because the game won't let you?

 

Once you start to replace the Covert OPS.

The original did some forced GDI vs GDI in mission 8.

Can you do something alike with NOD vs NOD?

And a special trigger that once the player has Obelisk of light. The AI spams "sufficient" buggies.

 

Another mission idea would be having just 1 stealth tank. A lot of towers and patrolling infantry. Your goal is to steal a crate and getting out.

[MattAttack]

But, why didn't you just add? Why is it replace? Simply because the game won't let you?

If you're asking why I'm replacing the original missions instead of adding to the covert ops, there are a couple reasons...

First, there are certain concepts that are ONLY hardcoded into the original missions..... Besides CHAN spawning from a destroyed Tech center which you can link triggers to in mission 10 (I think) and a couple things like that there are also small behavioral things like Harvesters not running over attacking infantry or structures not repairing as quickly in the first couple of missions.  Also, I like the idea of having alternates for more replay value and replacing ALL of the missions is, well, just utterly insane!

Can you do something alike with NOD vs NOD?

EXCELLENT IDEA!!! I will do this!

And a special trigger that once the player has Obelisk of light. The AI spams "sufficient" buggies.

heh heh, I'm already planning on having triggers where the AI spams TONS of infantry every time you build an obelisk!

Another mission idea would be having just 1 stealth tank. A lot of towers and patrolling infantry. Your goal is to steal a crate and getting out.

Alas, 1 small problem with this is that it would have to involve celltriggers and Stealths won't activate them if cloaked.  Hmmmmm.... could perhaps have a different goal, though.  Maybe a squad of Stealths have to infiltrate the base and destroy a prototype Mammoth..... interesting.....

 

But thank you for the input!! Stuff like that is immensely helpful and all of those ideas are good!  And if anyone has any half-finished maps or just concepts they'd like to contribute, I'll gladly take them into consideration..... Which reminds me--- being the horrible douchebag that I am, I totally forgot to credit cn2mc for Nod mission 3EB.  It's a map he totally made (which I only altered slightly) and I adapted his basic concept into the mission.  SORRY!

[CRITAWAKETS]

Oh i have a good idea. If you build a mammoth tank the enemy will spawn obelisks of light.

[MattAttack]

Oh i have a good idea. If you build a mammoth tank the enemy will spawn obelisks of light.

I hate to concede that something is not possible in TD, but I regret to admit you cannot trigger events by building a certain kind of unit.  Only structures can activate a "built it" trigger.  Thanks for the input, though!

[Jacko]

Oh i have a good idea. If you build a mammoth tank the enemy will spawn obelisks of light.

I hate to concede that something is not possible in TD, but I regret to admit you cannot trigger events by building a certain kind of unit.  Only structures can activate a "built it" trigger.  Thanks for the input, though!

 

For completely useless input Red Alert DOES have this trigger.

 

But reactive AI sounds both awesome and scary at the same time. If its anything like building an obs in multiplayer I'd imagine some well placed flamers would sort that problem out.

[MattAttack]

But reactive AI sounds both awesome and scary at the same time. If its anything like building an obs in multiplayer I'd imagine some well placed flamers would sort that problem out.

 

Since it's all about that paper, rock, scissors thing why not throw scissors at the player if they're building paper.  And if they wise up, they'll have some spare rocks laying around nearby!   It'll also help randomize what the AI is doing, so a map will be a lot more unpredictable and you'll probably get a lot more replay value out of it......

 

That's interesting about RA though.  So you can attach a "built it" trigger to a particular unit? neat!

[X3M]

Well, I had one, tiny weeny, itsy bitchy,.. idea.

 

I like to screw with players minds. So the following mission should take place:

 

The (NOD) player starts with 10 commando's on the right of a village. Going left, they meet several MRLS. Going right shows a path.

The path leads them to some infantry guarding some power plants in a canyon. A trigger calls in 2 chinooks, both get shot down by the Advanced Guard towers that are standing on the edges.

If the player continieus to follow the path. From the right, some more MRLS come down, while the other MRLS come from that village.

So the only option:

Kill the infantry, then the power plants.

Now, the several Advanced Guard towers are powered down. And the MRLS are on their way!!

2 more chinooks come down. This time to pick up the commando's.

While flying to the next zone (green flare), the AI rebuilds the power plants. There might be a chance that the chinooks are shot down now. Or they survive barely.

The commando's exit the chinooks on the new site. Only to be squashed by a lot of APC's.

If a player decides to land down close to the Adv.Guard towers, well, there are several normal guard towers giving cover to the advanced ones.

 

Players will completely not know what to do here. These commando's are supposed to be doomed!!! No matter how hard the player tries.

 

On a side note, the player also has an MCV somewhere else, that becomes visible once it moves.

Since the player starts with 0. He/she has to move the MCV towards, another Conyard placed by GDI. Deploy the MCV and sell. There should come out an engineer for taking out the other Conyard. And the player now has barely enough for the Refinery.

 

What do you think? (If I would have time and the knowledge, I would make this mission myself)

[Jacko]

Well, I had one, tiny weeny, itsy bitchy,.. idea.

 

I like to screw with players minds. So the following mission should take place:

 

The (NOD) player starts with 10 commando's on the right of a village. Going left, they meet several MRLS. Going right shows a path.

The path leads them to some infantry guarding some power plants in a canyon. A trigger calls in 2 chinooks, both get shot down by the Advanced Guard towers that are standing on the edges.

If the player continieus to follow the path. From the right, some more MRLS come down, while the other MRLS come from that village.

So the only option:

Kill the infantry, then the power plants.

Now, the several Advanced Guard towers are powered down. And the MRLS are on their way!!

2 more chinooks come down. This time to pick up the commando's.

While flying to the next zone (green flare), the AI rebuilds the power plants. There might be a chance that the chinooks are shot down now. Or they survive barely.

The commando's exit the chinooks on the new site. Only to be squashed by a lot of APC's.

If a player decides to land down close to the Adv.Guard towers, well, there are several normal guard towers giving cover to the advanced ones.

 

Players will completely not know what to do here. These commando's are supposed to be doomed!!! No matter how hard the player tries.

 

On a side note, the player also has an MCV somewhere else, that becomes visible once it moves.

Since the player starts with 0. He/she has to move the MCV towards, another Conyard placed by GDI. Deploy the MCV and sell. There should come out an engineer for taking out the other Conyard. And the player now has barely enough for the Refinery.

 

What do you think? (If I would have time and the knowledge, I would make this mission myself)

 

I'm pretty sure only MattAttack would be cruel enough to make something like that

[MattAttack]

I'm pretty sure only MattAttack would be cruel enough to make something like that

 

Heh heh.... I'm making a concentrated effort to not be so sadistic anymore.... I moved the "impossible" gdi mission (blood beach) to level 4 and now you have commandos and can build grenadiers.  It's why input helps.  Since I made the mission I knew exactly how to beat it.  (and wrongly assumed others would find it easy)

 

And as far as X3M's suggestion:

It does sound a bit brutal, but for the most part do-able.  The only problems would be:

A) I wouldn't rely on the sold CY producing an engineer as it's a pretty big gamble and you wouldn't want your mission hinging on it. 

B) The "squishing" APCs probably would only sit there and shoot.  I don't think I'd reliably be able to get them to "squish"

C) If an MCV is on he map, it will be visible.  No way around that.  Maybe could reinforce it......

D) GDI MRLSs would be mixed tech! tsk tsk, a sin in my book! lol  (maybe rocket trucks?)

 

However, I really like the idea of a "power puzzle" mission and oddly enough, it's an idea I've been messing around a bit with lately.  I'll tell you what, if you make the complete "terrain/map" in XCC I'l take a crack at it.  Can't promise it'll make it into the campaign (in that form), but I like a challenge!

 

AND:  ATM I'm actually working on your Nod vs. Nod idea.  I'm going to make it one of the GDI 5 missions, since that's when Nod can build tanks and GDI can't.

[X3M]

O my, a challenge for learning something new.

XCC it is.

 

Some side notes:

- A, you are right. Let's not gamble.

- B, what does like to squish and is fast enough to do some of it? After one try, they still can start shooting. Those commandos will be doomed either way. The primary goal here is to get them to be doomed

- C, NOD 11(right map choice) has this secondary force. Most players only learn from it once radar kicks in. This can be done with the MCV as well, just without the radar kicking in. Just on the other side of the map. But then again, some engineers and some infantry instead can also do the job in taking over. However, we might as well scrap that extra construction yard to be conquered and only keep the MCV without anything protecting it. But there should be something going after that MCV, once players make the mistake with the commandos.

The money? How about some engineers getting a refinery plus harvester and 2 silo's?

- D, If it is NOD vs GDI, then they would be able to have MRLS? I do mean the rocket tanks. I know that others have another name for it. I mean this one: http://media.moddb.com/images/groups/1/1/897/CNCTD_M270_MRLS.png

 

I am slow, but I will try.

[MattAttack]

Oops, I am the slow one!  You are right about the MRLS.  I was confused and thought you were talking about the SSM. (the flame/napalm rockets) As far as the squishing, the problem is that they probably wont try to squish unless the commandos shoot at them.  I'll have to test to see how to work this out.

 

As far as making the map, this video is a good start.  A lot of the stuff he's talking about is in regards to multiplayer maps, but it's still a good guide to making what's needed.

https://youtu.be/xfmT_mwPIFA

 

It's not that hard, it is jut a little time consuming to get it to look nice.

[X3M]

I got another suggestion. Please tell me what you think.

 

Since I noticed how certain units are under used. According to some other topics.

How about making missions that high light these units.

 

We need a GDI mission, where the MRLS will SHINE!!!

 

I suggest that the player deals with a very heavy infantry/air opponent. And the base space is rather small. Too small for mass power plants that support a wall of advanced guard towers.

 

The only choice for the player would be getting a advanced communications centre and pump out MRLS.

Seeing as there are plenty of choices for anti infantry. Simply give the NOD AI like 12 heli pads. Some (2 times 3 on each side of the base) on guard for when you attack their base (figuring bazooka will get melted by those anti infantry guns) you need MRLS for attacks. And the other 6 come from time to time to your base for a rape.

 

AI should be triggered to react with something good against advanced guard towers. And best if the AI also rapes any medium or mammoth tank.

 

Other than that. Plenty of infantry men that the player needs at least 7 MRLS in a line for defences. No flamethrowers that lay teammates into ashes.

[MattAttack]

heh heh... I definitely am basing a lot of missions around specific units/tactics.  And strangely enough, you've sort of described what I'm doing for one of the Nod mission 8's.  Since in the original game by then the ORCA is introduced (scb07ec, I think) I was going to have the player, on an island too small to build an airstrip, fending off enemy ORCA reinforcements as well as Medium tanks reinforced via hovercraft.  One must then ask themselves, "what is available on build level 8 that is not reinforced on an airstrip?"  There are several options to go with.  (sorry, I don't want to spoil too much!)

    I'll definitely keep it in mind when I get to tech level 13 or whenever it is you get Adv Comm center.  Heh heh I like the "AI reacting to building AGT's" idea.  I'm going for a lot of that in this campaign.  However, I think Mammoth Tank may be available at the same time, too.  Although I guess you'd need room for a repair bay as well.  hmmm...... interesting

[X3M]

I have tried once again. Just the way you described. But i failed again. ( i suck i know, but might be tje beer this time) . Can you post a vodeo how you do this missio5?