Unanimous Change

[FlyingMustache]

Hello everyone!

If there could be any change to the game, what would you all vote for? A unanimous change.

Apocs shoot move? Improved flak troopers? Nothing? Let's dig into it!

[[CC] RaVaGe]

First of all the community needs to stop acting like a bunch of immature fucking teenagers raging about each other's e-penis scales and coordinate everyone's contributions to benefit the whole.

[heldro]

7 minutes ic

[ZiGZaG]

  On 1/25/2018 at 8:23 PM, FlyingMustache said:

Hello everyone!

If there could be any change to the game, what would you all vote for? A unanimous change.

Apocs shoot move? Improved flak troopers? Nothing? Let's dig into it!

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Id remove all the glitches/bugs that can be abused and leave the base game.

Mags not bieng able to attack units on a ridge (from below) above them would be nice aswell

Edited January 25, 2018 by ZiGZaG

[Plokite_Wolf]

  On 1/25/2018 at 9:10 PM, ZiGZaG said:

Mags not bieng able to attack units on a ridge above them would be nice aswell

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...why?

[ZiGZaG]

  On 1/25/2018 at 9:25 PM, Plokite_Wolf said:

...why?

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it makes too many map's unplayable against the yuri faction.

[DoDger]

 i would change yuri's navy so that you can't get the boomer until u get the lap not the rader also i think i agree with Ziggy about the mags Part

[ZiGZaG]

  On 1/25/2018 at 10:06 PM, DoDger said:

 i would change yuri's navy so that you can't get the boomer until u get the lap not the rader also i think i agree with Ziggy about the mags Part

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that would make yuri useless at sea though.. imagine this situation when your yuri playing allied on depth/alaskan

Edited January 25, 2018 by ZiGZaG

[DoDger]

  On 1/25/2018 at 10:09 PM, ZiGZaG said:

that would make yuri useless at sea though..

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i thought about it b4 and getting the boomers at lap sure puts the navy behind but yuri doesn't need navy to defend from other's players navy they can use disc's mag's yuri prime so most of the time when i use the boomer i use it to attack not to defend and since it's not visible it makes sneaking up on the enemy abit easier all i want is to stop the boomer rush early game but i could be wrong since this hv never been tested b4 it could make yuri rly bad at navy who knows
Maybe at some maps it would rly put yuri behind but at some other maps it would at least equal the gameplay abit

Edited January 25, 2018 by DoDger

[Plokite_Wolf]

  On 1/25/2018 at 9:59 PM, ZiGZaG said:

it makes too many map's unplayable against the yuri faction.

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Think of Magnetrons as late-game artillery in the same way as Prism Tanks and Siege Choppers and it'll make more sense.

 

  On 1/25/2018 at 10:18 PM, DoDger said:

Maybe at some maps it would rly put yuri behind but at some other maps it would at least equal the gameplay abit

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You can't balance a game by creating another imbalance.

[ZiGZaG]

  On 1/25/2018 at 10:35 PM, Plokite_Wolf said:

Think of Magnetrons as late-game artillery in the same way as Prism Tanks and Siege Choppers and it'll make more sense.

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Yea i understand the concept behind it but they aren't 3rd tier units like Siege/Prisim and it doesnt quite pan out that way, id say its more comparable to v3 than a siege in that sense, also prizims cant shoot over a ridge. on a map like Snow Valley/Tour of Egypt/Soveriegn land and many other's a single magnetron can end a game within a matter of second's, a prizim/siege cannot. On flat land they arent a problem really. 

For example this is one of the main reason's why in the MX mods mustacheX makes, mag's cant attack miners.

 

this (and the mutator) is why yuri is reffered to as 'overpowerd' imo. All the other units are fine (boomers included) if u ask me.

Edited January 25, 2018 by ZiGZaG

[ZiGZaG]

  On 1/25/2018 at 10:18 PM, DoDger said:

i thought about it b4 and getting the boomers at lap sure puts the navy behind but yuri doesn't need navy to defend from other's players navy they can use disc's mag's yuri prime so most of the time when i use the boomer i use it to attack not to defend and since it's not visible it makes sneaking up on the enemy abit easier all i want is to stop the boomer rush early game but i could be wrong since this hv never been tested b4 it could make yuri rly bad at navy who knows
Maybe at some maps it would rly put yuri behind but at some other maps it would at least equal the gameplay abit

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Vs allies in this situation yuri wouldnt be able to make naval at all. You might get 1-2 boomers if ur lucky. Dolphins destroy naval yards far too quick. I think the naval set up is about right personally.

[DoDger]

  On 1/25/2018 at 10:35 PM, Plokite_Wolf said:

 

You can't balance a game by creating another imbalance

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True but u never know until u try and since that wont happen then u will never know!


for me iam just bored of all soviet [iraq basically] or maybe sometimes allies while yuri is being ignored once u pick yuri ppl start crying  [not all i understand that] but it's just not right to play iraq all the time or allies all the time just for change of pace why not yuri without getting called Lame Gay yuri noob etc... if i rly wanna change something it would be the community itself but that thing won't happen either
looking for different things is the main reason that pushed me towards Ra3 in the first place

Edited January 25, 2018 by DoDger

[scalpem]

boomers should have to deploy like choppers in order to bomb. takes a second or 2 and more vulnerable.

3 star IFVS are just dumb

remove mag

nerf soviet flak a lot

 

if not buffing units, then addressing the numerous glitches and buggy mechanics like: choppers deploying and undeploying is a mess (doesn't match same properties as GI's or other units, for unknown reasons) , miners don't take into account cliffs when going for "closest" ore, miners path like idiots, loading battlefortresses/amphibious transports could be WAAYYY easier. sometimes amphibious transports just won't let a unit in until the 3rd or more try. imagine a hotkey to have selected infantry load into possible transports (select group of 112 infantry, 17 bfs, automatically all try to enter different transports on one command.)

also way more glitches

[XXxPrePxX]

Nerf mags by what Zigzag is saying + make them not able to pick up miners.

 

 

[ZiGZaG]

  On 1/26/2018 at 3:18 AM, XXxPrePxX said:

Nerf mags by what Zigzag is saying + make them not able to pick up miners.

 

 

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I have no issue with them picking up miners, just think they shouldnt be able to pick up units on higher ground unless theres an entry point. I think if u did this it would be a much more even balanced playing field for allies/sovs.

[Plokite_Wolf]

  On 1/25/2018 at 10:42 PM, ZiGZaG said:

this (and the mutator) is why yuri is reffered to as 'overpowerd' imo.

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Mutator? You mean the "let's make all nearby infantry into near-useless anti-tank Hulk wannabes" button? It's a good counter against infantry spam (but who does this in RA2/YR?) and maybe commando units, but in general, I find the Genetic Mutator the single useless superweapon in the entire game.

 

  On 1/25/2018 at 11:30 PM, DoDger said:

True but u never know until u try and since that wont happen then u will never know!

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That "logic" can be applied to anything, but it isn't sound either way...

Edited January 26, 2018 by Plokite_Wolf

[heldro]

mutate your slaves or mutate a bunch of initiates made with cloning vats (you can mutate around 250 units at once i tested) grind them and yuri has unlimited money and wont run out of it in the long game when allieds and soviers will, take into consideration that yuri allready has a easy economy to manage and see its pretty unbalanced.

i dont think you really understand how this game works plokite.

[Plokite_Wolf]

 

  On 1/26/2018 at 1:42 PM, heldro said:

mutate your slaves or mutate a bunch of initiates made with cloning vats (you can mutate around 250 units at once i tested) grind them and yuri has unlimited money and wont run out of it in the long game when allieds and soviers will

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If you've got the ability to create that many units to grind, you don't need a Grinder to begin with...

 

  On 1/26/2018 at 1:42 PM, heldro said:

i dont think you really understand how this game works plokite.

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I've played it since 2001, bub.

[XXxPrePxX]

Plokite, your inability to understand what the mutator does from your first post shows that you don't really know how competitive YR is played.

 

As heldro pointed out, its basically an unlimited money cheat for YR while the sovs/allies  are forced to the demands of the map for money. Heldro used an extreme example, but it doesn't have to be that extreme. Think: you have 5 miners that each produce 5 free slave miners, pack them together with say 20 initiates and you have something like 45 brutes that you can grind by basically doing nothing (maybe spending money on 10 initiates). It also recharges every 5 minutes so it's an incredibly luxury late game which is why there is a window of opening that sov/allied player has against yuri and if it closes, then its gg.

[Plokite_Wolf]

  On 1/26/2018 at 3:31 PM, XXxPrePxX said:

Think: you have 5 miners that each produce 5 free slave miners, pack them together with say 20 initiates and you have something like 45 brutes that you can grind by basically doing nothing (maybe spending money on 10 initiates). It also recharges every 5 minutes so it's an incredibly luxury late game which is why there is a window of opening that sov/allied player has against yuri and if it closes, then its gg.

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That seems reasonable, but if you let your opponent have that many disposable slaves (e.g. none of the ore fields in his reach have any ore left) and is desperate to get money that way, and even got the opportunity to build a superweapon, that means you're not harassing well and/or often enough, and no rebalancing of the Genetic Mutator will change that.

[XXxPrePxX]

In normal 1on1 competitive games, it is pretty typical for every player to have at least 5 miners and be able to build up to superweapons. In fact, that is usually's yuri's primary plan (i.e. they really don't rush players, they play the long game). It's very difficult to rush yuri from either side allies or soviets making it a game of superweapons. 

You can try rushing a good yuri player early, but you'll lose. It's a game of superweapons, 90%+ time against yuri.

With all due respect, I don't think you've played competitively enough to see the effect that a mutator has based on your replies so far. You seem to have a lower skill level, which is fine, but a mutator really doesn't effect that tier of play, but rather the competitive tier.

 

Edited January 26, 2018 by XXxPrePxX

[Lud0wig]

I have a cool idea, stop talking about a stupid superweapon which cannot be balanced because it does just 1 thing and play RA2 if you don't like Yuri, easy

[[CC] RaVaGe]

IMO Yuri's first cause for being overpowered is their power plant efficiency.
They can easily get a power plant equivalent of a nuclear power plant by inserting infantry, which enables them to tech quicker than other factions.

If you decrease the base level power output of a Yuri power plant to necessitate the insertion of more infantry to reach a slightly higher output at maximum upgrade level compared to a normal Allied/Soviet power plant then you will slow down the rate at which a Yuri player can fast tech to boomers, supers, psychic tower base walking.
This effectively generates a larger window for Allied/Soviet players to abuse.

Combine the above with nerfs to magnetron by removing auto mag and the ability to hit units on a cliff, with also a nerf to gattling weapon's effectiveness against terror drones, air units and infantry, Yuri becomes much more manageable on all maps.

If we would start balance patching specific items without thought to the whole, we'd still end up with an unbalanced mess.

[XXxPrePxX]

  On 1/26/2018 at 4:19 PM, Lud0wig said:

I have a cool idea, stop talking about a stupid superweapon which cannot be balanced because it does just 1 thing and play RA2 if you don't like Yuri, easy

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Just because we are talking about the genetic mutator does not mean we'd wish to run away to Ra2. Calm.