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Grant

Q1 - Is there anything "sacred" you would advise NOT to change in Remaster?

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EA_Jimtern:

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Let me ask, is there anything "sacred" you would advise NOT to change in Remaster? Obviously that's a difficult proposition when not revealing the exact plan, but more in general. For example, many of the threads so far have said its okay to make UI updates.

 

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2 hours ago, JamesRyko said:

I don’t know what TD stands for but I’m sure your better at it than me. WW wanted the harvesters to need to be intensely controlled in order to be maximumly effecient.. on tiberian sun anyways. Maybe on whatever TD is hat isn’t the case. Sorry for jumping to conclusions.

Tiberian Dawn, the first C&C, which is the game that actually has a 25th anniversary the soonest (2020).

I agree harv micro is a very, very important part of the game, and should remain so, but the thing is that harv logic in TD and the first Red Alert skews the balance. Southern players' harvs will wander North and thus slow down income if they aren't constantly kept under eye, while players in the North positions need to micro their harvs less. I'm not sure that is the case in TS.

No problem about the 'conclusions' part, you'll also surely maul me if we play TS.

Back on topic. In my first post I forgot to say I'd like bigger maps, maybe because I've already said it in like 5 other threads about that.

What I'd like to see as options in a potential TD remaster is:

- Fog of war - I've always wondered what this game would play like with true FoW.

- FoW would also mean giving aircraft vision.

- Giving helis vision alone is also not a bad option to have.

- Loss of tech/'requirements actually required'. Currently you can build and sell tech buildings, but you still retain the new construction options until you lose all related construction facilities.

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I’m hoping to see some new dlc but only thing is the micro transactions... that is always a deal breaker. If you remaster the old games I hope you keep the “original” games the same. I hope to see new characters and units in the dlcs if you ever release them! Some of the older games I don’t think would be as profitable to release new dlcs, several games I’m hoping to see with new dlcs  are red alert 2, generals, and Tiberius wars, 

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The CnCNet its so cool and smooth we need to stay with two options of course wich is play online from in side game or from cncnet and add zoom in and zoom out Feature and we need good graphics plzzzzzzzz .. and there problem with the original games wich i can type in arabic to my friends plzzzz add arabic feature

Edited by DeathWish
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I would love for RA2 to be touched up a bit. Bug fixes, resolution fix, better multiplayer options.. Keep the campaign and videos though. 

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This I would not want to see changed at all:

  • Resources - Tirberium and Ore being on the ground, gathered by harvesters, with terrain objects that spawn resources around them (ore mine/tib tree). I don't care for the resource nodes from RA3, or the lack of resources from C&C4.
  • Base Building - The method of grid-based base building pleased my OCD-like mind, but I was okay with C&C3, so long as we don't have base size restrictions.
  • Single Player Campaigns - The campaigns of all the titles up to C&C3:KW are precious to me, even as campy as they are at times. I would very much prefer to see them not excluded - cut-scenes and all.
  • Music - If you can get higher quality audio, great, but I would prefer the original scores not be changed or removed. New music is fine.
  • The INI files / modding - the ability to change the INI files added a giant layer of replay-ability to the older games. Being able to easily mod the game is a HUGE plus for me.
  • Map making: Even if we need to use 3rd party applications, I want to be able to create maps with full scripting functions.

This I would be okay with changing:

  • Interface - I'm okay with the interface of C&C3:KW, but the system of each building having a separate queue probably would be a balancing concern with the older titles. I'd be okay with keeping the single queue system with building speeds increased with multiple structures from the older titles.
  • Designing unique structures for each faction: Some of the older titles had structures that were the same no matter what side you were on. For instance, MCVs, refineries, harvesters, power plants, etc. I would actually prefer if each side had a unique structures, even if they aren't visually different. Map making / modding was a bit of a pain when dealing with the shared structures and building requirements (I.E. War factories in RA1).
  • Quality of Life changes: Things like building walls in sections (C&C:TS, RA2) instead of piece by piece, build queues for units and infantry, ability to power down structures (C&C:TS), select all units / select all type units.
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Thanks Ferret... and I agree with MrSeagull. Personally for Generals ZH (non-pro gamer):

The core gameplay elements were/are great for me and my friends. We like to play against hard AIs (but love it after the great fan made fixed AI mod) but the matches are so hard to play (in terms of performance). Sooner or later the gameplay is like a slow motion show. No always but I would guess 90% of our nights. Apart from this I think the game was well made but almost impossible to play for people who like building bases or even only want to play against the AI. Today If someone says "anyone wanna play ZH" the first answer in the round is "nah, it'll surely crash/desyc or even will not start". 

The LAN & online desync bugs
If it's possible for 8 players to play, it should be playable under all circumstances. ZH begins to stuck even If only the AIs are playing against each other.

The low/bad AI performance
People in their free time fixed a lot of things but the core performance is poorly from our perspective. An AI for example should always try to rebuild the own base :-)

I think If this is the core element of a ZH remake, it should be no problem to build a pro-gamer system around. Like the choice in FIFA to get the recent stats of the teams but instead load all the balanced patches and other stuff.

Just my thoughts as a big casual CC-fan from the first hour :-)

Edited by sensosio
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keep gameplay exactly the same (maybe some balance and bug fixes). HD textures and resolutions. compatibility with newer versions of windows. online multiplayer. keep the audio/videos the same, just maybe updated to HD with more clarity. it needs to feel like the same game, just refreshed a little bit to keep the nostalgia for the players coming back, but updated enough for first time players to be able to appreciate the original experience.

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I would like to see a remastered version of Sole Survivor. Keep the game the way it is, but make it compatible with newer windows and we can play online straight from the game's main menu without needing a 3rd party program to run it.

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As others have said, sacred are the soundtrack (or rather sound in general, the death screams are perfect) and FMVs. Except quality of life improvements and other "new" standards (such as production queues, air units regular movement control, veterancy ranks... stuff already present in later C&C installments), the gameplay is sacred as well -do NOT add secondary skills etc.

I wonder whether they are going 3D (kind of what at some point they said Generals 2 would evolve into, a single engine for different games) or stay with the same design with upgraded sprites (if they achieve the quality of TS and RA2, that would be perfect). In any case, don't change the the way things look; I fear EA might be tempted to redo the artworks for the sake of artistic direction consistency with the later games.

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PLAYABILITY.
That's why I still keep playing Red Alert 2 and never played Red Alert 3...
Better Graffics, TExtures, Animations. Yhats it.

IMHO.

Nice to hear wabout what your going to do! Count me in!

 

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In terms of sacredness I will say EA should respect the core gameplay of classic C&C (C&C95, RA1, TS and their respective expansions), to further expand upon this I make a description of the three main elements inherent to this core:

  • A tech-tree reliant upon different static production and tech structures build through a construction yard (A few of them may be capable to redeploy or have no need of power plants)
  • Collector-refinery based economy reliant in tiberium or ore fields (although tiberium spikes, oil derricks and other secondary forms of economy are welcome)
  • Infantry, vehicles and aircraft divided in tiers capable to work in synergy to create a functional fighting machine (at least a non-tournament gaming level)

I believe as long as you respect these three elements things will be good.

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- The Music

- The Voices

- The actors in the FMVs

- The hotkeys (allow them to be remappable)

- Modding and Mapping capability and tools. People want to be able to mod and map the game. They want to add 3rd, 4th and 5th factions with new unit & gameplay mechanics, their own UIs for the new factions, etc. - Let them do it, please! That's how the C&C Community survived for so long.

- No paid content, even if it's skins, only. Skins could be an extra thing for pre-ordering and for the collector's edition, but that should end there. Skins could work in a new C&C game, but I can hardly see it in a remaster, especially if it's one of the 2D games like RA1, TD, TS and RA2.

 

What can be changed:

Adapting the UI and more varied and modern waypoint, build queue, unit pathfinding and formation mechanics from C&C3 and such can work, but the rest must remain the same. It could work if you had a classic mode like with DTA, for example. In classic mode, GDI and Nod have their original TD arsenal but in "Enhanced mode", GDI gets Hover MLRS, mechs, Nod gets subterranean beam cannons, cyborgs, etc. - as well as an additional tech center, to lengthen the build orders and tiers. Maybe in "Enhanced mode", you can build several build queues ala C&C3 and RA3 instead of each subsequent ConYard, War Factory or Barracks simply speeding up unit production. I can see that work. The art style can be changed to 3D with a fixed camera in classic mode, but enhanced mode lets you maybe rotate buildings ala RA3 and the camera, as well.

Edited by Alex06

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To be honest, don't alter the overall game play. Graphics is the only concern, to me at least.

I am a Yuri's Revenge player by the way. I love how the game play mechanic work.

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I really hope u gona remaster C&C red alert 1 and General,  (not zero hour too much cheated units...)   

Red alert 1 and general where the best micro games and the survival mode are insane on it!  Much fun!  Plz don't forget to put back map builder  cause it was very bugged on general.  

I can't wait to see general back honnestly, most interesting game.  The "realistic" graphic make it so cool.  

If u want add some "pax feature"  then add things like avatars,  units disign or things like that than have only "visual" change and doesn't affect the game.  So people will support you and it won't be a pay to win.  

Thx for reading. 


 

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It's really simple from my opinion.. DON'T CHANGE ANYTHING!! Just make the game compatible with new systems, improve frame rate and resolution, and make it compatible with new systems that didnt exist at the time such as ChromeOS (Chromebooks). Other than that I just want the original games. Some of the best remastered games weren't changed much from their originals. Please don't change the gameplay or add crates and stuff, I'd rather spend more money to buy the game than get it cheaper or free and then be expected to buy in-game content. 

 

From a long-time C&C fan! 

-Disguise_AU 

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While everyone is saying not to touch the gameplay, after over a decade of playing RA2 and continuing on YR, I can easily confirm that, do indeed add balance adjustments.

With the above mentioned classics only minor changes can bring the game to a fairly perfect gameplay balance.
For example, Allied air units being a bit more durable and not instantly dying to anti air weapons of all other sides.

 

If there's one thing I can really suggest, it's that to me it seems past C&C games have lacked play-testing from veteran C&C fans and competitive gamers.
When and if you guys finally get to that stage please include the old competitive players in your beta.

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Don't change the graphics (I don't want Red Alert (1) to look like Red Alert 2 graphics). Just keep it simple. That's the most sacred thing I want left untouched.

As for giving suggestions: windows compatibility, bug fixes, AI pathfinding and online competitiveness is probably the first thing that comes to everyone's mind. I would like some new official maps, missions (separated from the main campaign like covert ops, counterstrike and aftermath) and the return of the Technician units in the later C&C game remakes. Hopefully Renegade and older C&C games (Sole Survivor included) gets a remake first.

It's good to see so many new accounts having their first post in this remake topic. Just shows it can really attract new players.

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any game that you're creating, i hope you'll take a look at the balanced factions aspect of it. also better graphics plz

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This will apply for any remaster or future C&C game but I also wish to add and request no over saturated cartoonish themes and graphics that turns a gritty semi-realistic military strategy game and its units and factions into a bunch of toys or an anime cartoon. (looking at you, RA3 & C&C4) What was appealing to me about C&C1, RA1, and Generals was the aspect of it being realistic gritty warfare with a touch of sci-fi. This is C&C, not Warcraft or Starcraft. I will be fair to say EA did in fact do a decent job keeping that atmosphere with C&C3.

Speaking of this topic,  here was my guidelines I submitted back when EA announced C&C Generals 2.

Heck, how about reviving that game while we are at it?

Edited by sgtmyers88
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As a ra2/yr expansion player for nearly 17 years and seven rank 1's,  I have to give my input and agree with those who suggest keeping the game true to the original. Blizzard did it with StarCraft in 4k. The gameplay is essentially unchanged just the graphics are improved. It would be very nice seeing the same route taken with ra2 and yr.  Having the same speed and feel of the original gameplay is crucial to a remaster, because it preserves the gameplay everyone loves while improving on the atmosphere of the game itself and making it more immersive.

Plus points such as adding better graphics, effects and long lasting online multiplayer support would be a no brainer and bring many people back.

 Changing any of the gameplay and atmosphere of the classics deviates from what everyone is used to and probably would be a let down. 

Edited by sunny

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Just ask yourself this one question..... What negative aspect of the game caused a massive drop in activity. If the gameplay it self is out dated and undesirable, then why bring it back? It’s now even more outdated and unenjoyable minhs a small sample of the community. The reason ra2 and yuris revenge activity dropped substantially on WOL in a very short period of time was the lack of ability to control all the cheaters. Ladder hack, map hack, President ifv, with the constant bot spamming of the games caused a mass exodus from the game. The other X factor was the xwis server being created which split the remaining community up. Then the WOL server shutting down with a lot of people not knowing how to move over to the other server. There was (and maybe still is) 1000+ players on the Chinese servers still playing ra2 a couple years ago. So the game playability did not drop off since it’s introduction.

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I think the single most important thing to NOT change in the games from tiberian sun backward are the graphics.  The old style graphics really make it them stand out.

 

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It seems that these are the main categories 

 

1) keep the game exactly as it is but minor improvements in graphics, glitches, features (like a very minor upgrade, its almost pointless you may as well stick to the original, if you are so fanatical about the original and its glitches stay on the original ) This is great clearly but we have it here at cnc.net already almost, so whats the point? Also do you really expect EA to make such minor changes and release it as a game to sell, its just unrealistic talk in this category .

2) keep the game as it is but fully improve balance glitches features and the graphics get a boost (like an upgrade, but not the way open ra/cnc did it they failed because they introduced a different feel, it needs to be like street fighter hd remix vs street fighter 2 the original, ie better graphics and balance but underneath its the exact same game almost, open cnc/ra1 went too far away from the original its not the same game it feels different) if you keep the feel and improve features graphics and minor balance tweeks  you create magic, a perfected classic.We also want our life time of skill acquisition to translate over into the new game which it doesn't for open cnc)  

3) A new game engine that's 3d ,modern etc like one of those total conversion mods (like a new game) a remake not a remaster although it could fall under the remaster category since its mainly a graphics upgrade, but it isn't the classic game anymore, so it will be like getting used to a new game almost, skill sets will be lost, but it has big advantage's for looks balance, features, etc while keeping alot of nostalgia and what we love.  This is good it will work and please most people but its the other side of the spectrum of opinion for us  hard core fans.

4) A new game that has new units and the old ones so something like cnc3 but with better graphics and more  of the old units and buildings , this will also please most ppl just like cnc3 did, but will annoy alot of hard core fans (but it wont be like cnc4 which was throwing away the basic cnc formula that's the only way for EA to really fail on this )  this is no longer remaster territory but that word has been used loosely so will include this category, the advantages of this are the same advantages a new game has ie fresh gameplay new units features etc more replay ability less of the same old same old but also keeping the nostalgia alive and comfort zones alive a little, while adding the fresh new variety.

 

I think we should compromise and go for option 2, since we are all so divided. If you cant agree the only logical solution is to compromise. Plus we already have the original so those that want no to little change don't need a remaster.

 

There's a BIG chance that EA will want to use its modern engine like frost bite (that they have already created/bought) and there's a high probability that we will get something like option 3 regardless of what many of us want, there's no way they are going to go for option 1 realistically its too little of a change, we'd be lucky to get option 2.  I say vote for 2.

I personally like 2 and 4 then 3 but not 1

 

 

Edited by chem
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This hasn't been mentioned yet but it was brought up by neogrant that it should come with a physical copy/release. I thought that was a brilliant idea!

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